[Ducati] getting more from a 996

Sun Dec 31 16:03:17 EST 2006

Already done that for the past two years, now I'm getting a little board 
with the drive off the corners. Riding my buddies bikes, that are making 
140+rwhp, kind of makes you realize what you are missing.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "mike major" <textike at yahoo.com>
To: "Ducati Owners Group" <ducati at ducati.net>
Sent: Friday, December 29, 2006 12:25 AM
Subject: Re: [Ducati] getting more from a 996

> Or you could throw on some sticky tires and go have fun....Moonbeam
>
> cedwards105 <cedwards105 at cfl.rr.com> wrote:  Well thanks to all that 
> responded. I also have a friend who did some pretty
> extensive stuff to his 996 by (old) BCM and looking at his costs and the
> cost of many of the suggestions in this thread, I've decided to bite the
> bullet and get a 1098 instead. I would have ended up spending about 2/3rds
> the cost of a stock 1098 on a soon to be 7 year old bike, didn't make much
> sense.
>
> So I'll be getting rid of my '00 996S or parting it out at some point.
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Rich Roberts"
> To: "Ducati Owners Group"
> Sent: Saturday, December 23, 2006 12:18 PM
> Subject: Re: [Ducati] getting more from a 996
>
>
> Like others here, if getting heads done send to Guy in Canada. He is one 
> of
> the best...and always looking for a better way...cam degreeing it helps to
> have the block for dial indicator....if you happen to get up with Guy tell
> him I was asking for the one I gave him in Daytona some years back....:)
> Anyway sounds like you have had sleeves rolled up a time or two. I may 
> even
> still have some offset keys in the garage. I would have to check, but
> Ferraci is your best bet there. Shim set, nah....On my old 916/955 I think
> over near 10 years I bought maybe 4 shims...course I have a rig in garage
> for lapping em to the nearest .01mm so I usually shift em around til I 
> have
> made the best of it and then I buy the one or two I might need, course if
> you go to Guy you need to go with the MBP collets and that will change all
> of that, meaning you wont be reshimming much afterwards. When you replaced
> pistons did you balance em? As Art suggests...squish is a big part of the
> power gains. I set
> mine at maybe .040" with solder to measure. You set with new base gaskets
> and head gaskets, most of which you should still be able to get from 
> Cometic
> I think. Back in the early years I think I was the second person to use 
> them
> after FbF. I would stay away from the copper head gaskets. I never could 
> get
> em not to leak. Also be very careful setting squish....040 is as close as 
> I
> would get. I think once I went down just below that at .038 or something
> like that and the piston was just kissing the head, enough to make the 
> head
> gasket leak just a bit. Course depends on pistons you use as well I think
> then I was using JE and went back to Wiseco. Also a good time to take
> advantage of HPC coatins and get crown and skirts done. Times have changed
> abit since then and you have lots of piston options now. Pistal I think is
> what many like. I would balance to nearest gram and get rid of all sharp
> edges. I shave off material from inside of skirt with a dremel to get both
> pistons to
> nearest gram. I suspect you know that ideally when changing pistons at 
> some
> point you need to go back and rebalance crank...Usually done as asssmbly
> with pistons rods and crank all included. I think I even sent flywheel and
> such to Falicon when I did it. If you do not there is a chance you will 
> get
> a bit of vibration at the higher rpms. I ran that way for a year or so 
> with
> no problems with 125 rwhp and 75 foot pounds but then next winter redid 
> the
> bottom end. All of this stuff is kind of old news and lots of info out 
> there
> and ways to go. I went down this road in the early years when lots of 
> things
> were still kind of new. But I was the guy doing it in my garage, short of
> cutting in new seats and the like. Lots of folks have made a business of
> this expereince and things are a lot more standard. Guy likely represents
> the best resource for all of that info
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: cedwards105
> To: Ducati Owners Group
> Sent: Friday, December 22, 2006 6:36:18 PM
> Subject: Re: [Ducati] getting more from a 996
>
>
> I'm in Orlando so we don't have a place to close for getting shims. We 
> have
> a new shop in Daytona and Tony Foster is also still there, Chris Boy is
> about 4 hours down the road in Fort Lauderdale.
>
>>From a mechanical side I've had a 916 the motor out, replaced pistons
>>twice,
> had the entire flywheel and clutch side assemblies off, I've just never 
> got
> to the point of splitting the crankcases. If I had a shim set, and offset
> keys for degreeing the cams, I'd have no problem having a go at it myself,
> as long as knew where they should start to open the intakes and exhaust
> valves.
>
> I actually have a spare 916 motor that I could play with to get a little
> more mechanical knowledge.
>
> My gut feel is that I would either make a trip to BCM and stay there a few
> days so I could bring the bike back with me.
>
> But what if I just sent my heads the them to have the cams put in and 
> valves
> and porting done.
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Rich Roberts"
> To: "Ducati Owners Group"
> Sent: Friday, December 22, 2006 5:41 PM
> Subject: Re: [Ducati] getting more from a 996
>
>
> BCM if they still do as Bruce did will halve the weight of your flywheel.
> Key to keeping engine work reasonable is to do as much of the work 
> yourself
> as you can. If buying cams and paying someone to change, do shim 
> adjustment
> and degree it starts adding up in labor time, all things the typical home
> mechanic can do. Ways to save on shims if you are smart...Not sure what 
> size
> valves you have...SPS cams are more like stock thatn some of the other
> options meaning the duration and overlap are like stradas. They just have
> more lift. BCM is a good place to turn to. Of course all my past dealings
> was with Bruce and Kyle and the like. I know nothing about how things are
> going under Leslie, though I know of him a bit...so you should still be in
> good hands I think. There are lots of things you can do to that motor to 
> get
> a little more ummph, cheaper the more you do yourself. I think refereshing
> might also be in order, Though going up on valve size is also a typical 
> part
> of making
> head breath better along with cams. Still you can lap valves, get better
> sealing, degree cams etc. New cams I would lightly sand edges of cams, 
> check
> rockers out closely when cams out of the way. Not sure if you have ever 
> done
> a valve adjustment yourself...but new cams will require reshimming but you
> likely will be able to reuse alot of shims. And there are ways to lap a 
> shim
> to size if too tight and you would rather not just buy new. I make up a
> matrix and shift shims around first then do some lapping if need be and 
> then
> maybe end up buying just a couple. You take it to a shop they likely will
> just change em all out....as it is quicker. If you are doing yourself 
> there
> are things you can do that are smarter cause it is your time, not on the
> labor bill so to speak. Degreeing cams you need the tools and knowhow. But 
> I
> have said it once or twice before. If I can do it anyone can do it, just
> depends on if you want to roll up your sleeves and do yourself or...pay
> someone else.
> Still for track days I would not use an expensive bike...though I have had
> my old bike on the track I get just as much out of track days on just 
> about
> anything else. My wifes Speed Triple did me quite nicely at VIR.
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: cedwards105
> To: Ducati Owners Group
> Sent: Friday, December 22, 2006 11:27:05 AM
> Subject: Re: [Ducati] getting more from a 996
>
>
> Thanks for all the info, I have the suspension pretty much sorted out, 
> stock
> Ohlins rear with the proper spring for my weight, stock forks up front but
> again springed for me.
>
> I have a Dymag wheel up front, but the matching rear became a fiasco
> (http://www.mad-ducati.com/GalleryShow.php?SeqId=1&GalleryId=64) to 
> obtain,
> so I just have the stock 5 spoke aluminum out back. I have the 4 pad
> calipers with Braketech Axis rotors and a Brembo Master cylinder with 
> steel
> lines doing the business up front.
>
> I have a Bucci slipper clutch in it and I believe it has the Salt Lake 
> City
> chip mod done for the single injector. I have the gearing at 15/39, which 
> is
> pretty close to your 14/36.
>
> I guess the area where I feel it is lacking is that the motor feels slow 
> to
> spin up. I think I'll talk to BCM about the cams and will also have them
> mill a bit off my flywheel.
>
> I don't want to get into major dollars doing modifications on a 7 year old
> bike and I also want to keep it reliable. I love riding my 996 on the 
> track,
> but once the bill hits about $5K, I start thinking maybe I should just get 
> a
> year or two old GSX750R, which I have ridden in the past and love and 
> leave
> the 996 as is.
>
> I went down the search for HP route with my Bimota DB2 (900ss motor) and
> gained about 17rwhp for about $7000 worth or parts and labor, I don't 
> really
> want to repeat that.
>
> Thanks.
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Joe M Ribaudo"
> To:
> Sent: Friday, December 22, 2006 10:57 AM
> Subject: Re: [Ducati] getting more from a 996
>
>
>>
>> I'm with Rich here. I've got a 2001 996 w/ SPS cams, Termi 1/2 system
>> (not
>> slip-ons) and FIM chip (single injector)...no additional valve or head
>> work
>> necessary.
>> I don't know what the RWHP is...but it made a HUGE difference on street
>> and
>> track vs. just having slip-ons and FIM chip. I'm using 14/36 gearing and
>> rarely get out of 4th gear (good for over 130 mph).
>> On race-starts...Off the line - I can out drag a Gixxer750 to our T1 in
>> Loudon...if that helps set a tangible performance metric for you.
>> BottomLine-Best investment I've ever made in the bike (along with Mag.
>> wheels :-)
>> Merry Christmas/Happy Holidays,
>> Joe
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Date: Fri, 22 Dec 2006 03:31:34 -0800 (PST)
>> From: Rich Roberts
>> Subject: Re: [Ducati] getting more from a 996
>> To: Ducati Owners Group
>> Message-ID: <20061222113134.39453.qmail at web84204.mail.re3.yahoo.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ascii
>>
>> Course I do not think opening airbox on 996 is the way to go, SPS cams
>> will
>> make a big difference. And an FIM chip 15-20 might be a bit of a stretch
>> though. Cams good tune chip might get you 120 or so.
>> ----- Original Message ----
>> From: mike major
>> To: Ducati Owners Group
>> My 03 ST4s has the 996 engine and all I did is install Remus mufflers,
>> open
>> the air box with about a 2 by 4 slit near the top and have it dyno tuned
>> with a power commander. The result is a lot fatter torque curve and 121.6
>> rear wheel HP on the dyno. I got most of my info from the book, "Ducati
>> Desmoquattro Performance Handbook" by Ian Falloon, available through
>> motorbooks. Later, Moonbeam
>>
>> cedwards105 wrote: I have a bone stock '00
>> 996s.
>> My guess is it makes around 106-109rwhp. What could I do to get it to 
>> make
>> about another 15-20rwhp.
>> I have ridden a 996SPS, I'd like that kind of power and torque. Can I 
>> just
>> put SPS cams in it and maybe do the valves?
>> Thanks.
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